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  #16  
Old 15 Jan 2011, 01:00
conradk conradk is offline
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
I don't think I'd advise slowing down your upgrade that much. Given the stability of 4.0.8, I'd say upgrade. The upgrade isn't trivial however. Backup and duplicate your database, and test the upgrade on a new directory to see how it goes.

I caught quite a bit of flack from my users for upgrading the site. I upgraded too early in the 4.x release and should have waited. However, like I said, I have avoided many issues by slowing down the update timeline (unlike 3.8.x update timelines which was driven mostly be exploits). I have not yet enabled CMS and Blog due to some of the bugs that existed in previous versions but will likely do so soon.

A good CSS refresh will freshen up your site just as much as the vBulletin upgrade, so I disagree re: the competitive advantage. Content is what drives site popularity.
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  #17  
Old 15 Jan 2011, 13:29
shaqoneal shaqoneal is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
so you are saying 4.0.8 is stable?

Just forums alone, because that's all I want (not CMS or blog), is 3.8.6 faster and less resourc-intensive than 4.0.8?
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  #18  
Old 15 Jan 2011, 14:02
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TNCclubman TNCclubman is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Im still using vB3.8. Too scared to use vB4 on a live environment as its full of bugs.
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  #19  
Old 16 Jan 2011, 06:15
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Sarteck Sarteck is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
I don't really make much use of the CMS feature, and I could live with or without Blogs, tbh.

With vB 3.8.x, things were a lot easier to handle, especially when it came to design. There wasn't six dozen StyleVars for a heading--you had thead and tcat and other stuff that you could set in ONE PLACE and have it be uniform throughout the entire site. In this vB4, no such luck--if you want to make your own Style(s), you have to sit down and one-by-one see which StyleVar does what to which parts of the page, and half the StyleVars seem to simply not work at all (case in point, see my recent thread about trying to change the background colour of the Profile Sidebar).

And the Search... Gah. Don't get me started... Well, it's really no worse than vB3, I suppose, but in vB3, we were able to replace it with Sphinx. Trying to do so for vB4 met with utter failure.



Maybe it's my inexperience, stupidity, or plain Bad Luck, but vB4's been a lot more of a headache for us than vB3 ever was.
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  #20  
Old 19 Jan 2011, 23:45
brandondrury brandondrury is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
I'm still in upgrade-mode, but I've committed to vb4. Getting the theme right has been astronomically more time consuming than I had expected. (BTW, I HIGHLY recommend Opera's "Inspect Element" feature. It smokes Firebug by a zillion.) I gave up on the Style vars and just made my changes in additional.css and that saved me a few days of cussing. Seriously.

It's clear that the admin side of the CMS is not nearly as mature as Wordpress. That's okay, Wordpress is almost 10 years old or something.

Ideally, a fully and perfectly integrated Wordpress with vb 3.8 would be what I would want. However, I played with the mods for those and it was always clunky. So I never really considered that an option. I can't count the number of times I had to figure out how to get the two kids to play nice together (the two kids being vb and Wordpress) or had to perform redundant tasks with differing code.

I used RSS the best I could to more or less "join" the two worlds, but it was always half-cocked at best. Seeing what vB4 is capable of in this department was the big seller for me. They've got this "joining" thing right, at least from the visitor perspective.

For what I need, vB4 is ready to go. I'm really counting on a few contests on my part dramatically escalating the quantity and organization of user activity. We'll see. If I fail, I don't think it's the fault of vB4.

As mentioned, the current theme system of stylevars is something you'd expect from 1998 and is clearly not something that much thought went into.....at least not by a progressive kind of mind.

Seeing "critical" or "high priority" bugs from 4 month sago that still haven't been dealt with has been disappointing.

I seriously considered going with another platform, but I'm still convinced that vB with vbSEO is as good as it gets. It's what my users like, I rank very well in SEs. I can't really complain. I'll have to fight an unideal admin and unideal learning curve in the blog/CMS, but it'll be worth it, I think.

Built-in Facebook integration looks very fun.

I'll most likely be developing my own intensive-tracking system for marketing purposes as well as an intense per-user incentive mod.

I'm really hoping that the vB4 development team will step up their game, tie up all the loose ends, and start applying cutting edge thinking to future features. If not, I'll just have to do it myself.

Maybe it's my inexperience, stupidity, or plain Bad Luck, but vB4's been a lot more of a headache for us than vB3 ever was.
Upgrading for me has been a TOTAL headache. Of course, I'm guessing switching an active community over to a new platform is ALWAYS this way. There are many technical hurdles, but I think the user side is better than anything else out there.

Brandon
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  #21  
Old 20 Jan 2011, 01:16
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Idawg Idawg is offline
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
I installed my first 4.0 forum in Feb 2010, and upgraded my 2 biz sites in April. The install of 4 went well, BUT the upgrades crashed BOTH sites, to the point I had to install my current backups 2x before it finally ran. And the mods had not caught up yet, and I had to leave a lot of the mods out. I was and still am VERY disappointed in the upgrade system.

I would recommend a fresh install, but be VERY wary of upgrades from 3.8 to 4.x.x
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  #22  
Old 20 Jan 2011, 01:31
conradk conradk is offline
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
I should say, that I've only a couple of times gotten over 100 active users at one time. So who knows if it scales the same. But I'm finding 4.0.8 is about as fast and stable as 3.8.x was. And I have a chatbox + sidebar + gallery-what's new on the forum home. Page loads are not generally a problem though I've turned off some 4.x features to speed things up on the forum index - but I didn't really need those anyways. (Should say here that vB3.x was equally inefficient in displaying 'who's on')

Had to turn off Facebook Connect, but that was due to the hang loading the fb logo and fb bots - not a vB problem. Had to restrict Guest access due to bots following all links and causing SQL cpu usage to spike. I'm lucky in that the bloated (due to post/thread cache) file size of the db is not an issue with the hosting provider.
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  #23  
Old 26 Jan 2011, 09:20
SamirDarji SamirDarji is offline
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Great feedback guys! I've been sticking with the vb3 platform and will probably continue to do so. I think with the evolution going on in the world of communities, I may drop a forum format completely and go with something else if I can find a product and a company that will back it properly.
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  #24  
Old 07 Apr 2011, 20:51
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RedWingFan RedWingFan is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Originally Posted by shaqoneal View Post
When vBulletin 4 came out back in December '09, there were a lot of compliants of how it's not as good as vBulletin 3.8. Well, it's been over a year now.


In your opinion, is vBulletin 3.8 still better than vBulletin 4?
Bought the 4.x license just to keep updated with the 3.7/3.8 series. Set up a test 4.x forum--the moderators don't like it, and the test users didn't like the sluggishness. As the site admin and developer, I don't like the code bloat. And with no native Sphinx support, and a lack of time to dink around with trying to get Sphinx working on 4.x, It's a definite pass.

Short version: "No." vB4 is the last time we buy a license.
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  #25  
Old 08 Apr 2011, 19:12
Joey805 Joey805 is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
So what happens now that they have stopped allowing maintenance renewals for VB3? Once that expires, we can no longer receive patches and security updates. We are basically FORCED to goto VB4. I did a test upgrade yesterday from VB3.8 and it did not go well. A bunch of errors but I worked through it. I have the test forum up and running now but I do notices freezes and hangs which my VB3.8 forum does not experience. Overall, it just performs slower. I've also run into a few random bugs within the admincp as well.
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  #26  
Old 08 Apr 2011, 19:14
Brandon Sheley's Avatar
Brandon Sheley Brandon Sheley is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Real name: Brandon
vBulletin 4 works fine for me, if it didn't than I wouldn't of upgraded..

No one is FORCED to do anything.. You always have options
Those that say that, are just looking to argue in my experience
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  #27  
Old 08 Apr 2011, 19:18
misuse misuse is offline
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
I have been running a dev server since it came out. So far I see no reason to upgrade from 3.8.
The skinning/styling is near impossible for an intermediate user let alone a company that is one of the best template designers in the VB world. They have had their hands tied with template design since before the gold versions came out.

The ad spots are very limited! For those of us that make a living off our sites the spots and ability to ad new spots (there is none) makes VB4 a definate NO UPGRADE.

I feel like IB took over and wants everyone's sites to not make $ and all look the same. It would mean less customer support issues.

It seems now that they are trying to force us to upgrade. Great....

I want to use the new tech but not at the cost of losing $ and dealing with managing nightmares.

I have 3 dedicated servers running my site. My host said they would not support VB4 if upgraded to. Too buggy for them, this was yesterday!

Last edited by misuse; 08 Apr 2011 at 19:30.
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  #28  
Old 08 Apr 2011, 19:26
Joey805 Joey805 is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Originally Posted by misuse View Post
I have been running a dev server since it came out. So far I see no reason to upgrade from 3.8.
The skinning/styling is near impossible for an intermediate user let alone a company that is one of the best template designers in the VB world. They have had their hands tied with template design since before the gold versions came out.

The ad spots are very limited! For those of us that make a living off our sites the spots and ability to ad new spots (there is none) makes VB4 a definate NO UPGRADE.

I feel like IB took over and wants everyone's sites to not make $ and all look the same. It would mean less customer support issues.

It seems now that they are trying to force us to upgrade. Great....


I agree 100%
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  #29  
Old 08 Apr 2011, 20:51
Chase Chase is offline
 
Join Date: May 2002
I've gone back and forth probably 100 times whether or not I want to upgrade to 4.1.2. Right now I'm on 3.8.4, very happy with it, at the very least I would upgrade to 3.8.7.

I set up a test forum for 4.1.2 and here are some things I've noticed.

- Page load lags... seems to take a little longer to load normal pages, doesn't seem as fluid as 3.x... I am on a semi-dedicated server so it can't be that.

- Editing styles can be very challenging... this could especially be true for new owners with no experience. vB took away the simplicity and made things harder to customize, of course IMO. What drew me to vbulletin 9 years ago was the simplicity of the software... not to bash the developers, but I don't think they took us into consideration. Not everyone is an expert in design and customization.

- Adding tabs or nav links aren't as easy. Shouldn't this be a rather simple procedure? I don't want to deal with crazy conditions.

- And like many others have already stated, it seems like 4.x is more bloated than 3.x.
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  #30  
Old 08 Apr 2011, 21:07
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Boofo Boofo is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Real name: Rob
Originally Posted by Chase View Post
- Page load lags... seems to take a little longer to load normal pages, doesn't seem as fluid as 3.x... I am on a semi-dedicated server so it can't be that.
I agree. But you also have to remember how much more is going on in vb 4 than in vb 3.
Originally Posted by Chase View Post
- Editing styles can be very challenging... this could especially be true for new owners with no experience. vB took away the simplicity and made things harder to customize, of course IMO. What drew me to vbulletin 9 years ago was the simplicity of the software... not to bash the developers, but I don't think they took us into consideration. Not everyone is an expert in design and customization.
Yes and no. CSS is always the best way to go for most things. The only drawback is that there are some things you still cannot do via CSS that you can do with tables.
Originally Posted by Chase View Post
- Adding tabs or nav links aren't as easy. Shouldn't this be a rather simple procedure? I don't want to deal with crazy conditions.
Once you do it, it is not as daunting as you think. It gets easier.
Originally Posted by Chase View Post
- And like many others have already stated, it seems like 4.x is more bloated than 3.x.
True, again. But, as I said above, there is more going on in vb 4.
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