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  #46  
Old 22 May 2014, 17:41
final kaoss final kaoss is offline
 
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Good god you need to tell your final fantasy client to configure the copyright mod better lol, that footer is full of backlinks.

Last edited by final kaoss; 22 May 2014 at 17:56.
  #47  
Old 22 May 2014, 17:50
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Tigga Tigga is offline
 
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Originally Posted by katie hunter View Post
I have no issue with any plugin, only DB's, that is what i said on page 1 from the start, that i stay away from his plugins because of this issue which puts my site down until the entire process finishes.
I doubt many others make as many table alterations as his, simply because they're not necessary for that modification or because the author may not realize that altering a vB table would be better than trying to keep up with separate tables. I fully agree that it's best to avoid altering vB tables when you can, but it's often not the best practice if you want an add-on to run smoothly and without taking up any extra server resources. I'd much rather have it shut down my forum for 10 minutes during the install than to have it running extra queries during every page load after that. A 6 hour install time is obviously different, but apparently you're the only one that's experiencing times that are anywhere near that extreme, so I'd say it sounds more like DB has things balanced correctly and it's your server configuration that is suspect.
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  #48  
Old 22 May 2014, 17:57
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DragonByte Tech DragonByte Tech is offline
 
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Originally Posted by final kaoss View Post
Good god you need to tell your final fantasy client to configure the copyright mod better lol, that footer is full of backlinks.
That's kind of the idea

They are fine with having it like that, and it gives us more traffic, so everybody's happy


Fillip
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  #49  
Old 22 May 2014, 18:01
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katie hunter katie hunter is offline
 
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Originally Posted by DragonByte Tech View Post
Yes I did. I've never denied that we've had complaints from large forums as a result of the alters on the "post" and "user" tables. Nobody has ever complained about a 6+ hour lock, that is an issue on your server and your server alone.

A large forum is going to complain if it takes more than 30 seconds to install (which is the timeout value of PHP scripts on most servers), unless their server is setup to allow for PHP scripts to extend their execution time infinitely.

Please stop arguing the point with people who know more about this than you.
I'm not saying this to be offensive, I wouldn't argue with a chemist about the effects of certain drugs just because I at one point read a Wikipedia page. I accept that this person is more knowledgeable than me in the field of chemistry.

Just for fun, I'm going to show you how fast our database server can run an alter on a DB table that has 9 million rows in it.
The specs of the DB server are as follows:
CPU: 3.3Ghz e3-1230-V2 Ivy Bridge with HT
RAM: 8GB DDR3
HDD: 60GB Intel Solid State Drive 520 Series
OS: CentOS 6.5 x64


Block Disabled:      (Update License Status)  
Suspended or Unlicensed Members Cannot View Code.

As you can see, it has 9 million, 51 thousand, 7 hundred and 8 rows. This is approximately 6 times as many rows as you have in your "user" table.

A clean install of Advanced User Tagging (latest version at the time of writing) is going to run 9 alters in total against the "user" table (spread across 3 different installation steps). This modification does not alter the "post" table in any way, shape or form.

This is the result:
Block Disabled:      (Update License Status)  
Suspended or Unlicensed Members Cannot View Code.

In other words, 1 out of 9 alters takes 38.38 seconds on a machine that is empirically slower than yours.

Extrapolating this further, 9 out of 9 alters would take approximately 345.42 seconds, or 5.76 minutes.

What about uninstallation, you ask?
Block Disabled:      (Update License Status)  
Suspended or Unlicensed Members Cannot View Code.

1 out of 9 uninstallation steps takes 35.60 seconds.

Extrapolating this further, 9 out of 9 uninstallation steps would take 320.4 seconds or 5.34 minutes.

Even if we double, triple, quadruple, [...] the query time to account for the delay suffered when running this query via PHP as opposed to the command line, this does not come anywhere NEAR the 6+ hour time your server is experiencing.

The forum in question was http://www.finalfantasyforums.net/ which has over 1 million posts at the time of writing yet did not experience any issues when installing any of our modifications that make numerous alters to the "post" table.
(We host this forum, and the database server the forum runs on is the machine whose specs I listed above.)

I'm very much going to enjoy hearing your next round of excuses

Fillip
Who said excuses. I know what i encountered. You want to tell me that only your plugins are causing issues on my forum when install or uninstall and all the other plugins by other members doesn't have the same affect ? Because that is what i noticed and saw (only yours), that is why i said i never try to install any because of this issue, it is kinda scary actually not knowing when the task will be finished and to wait that long.

My server admin has access to this topic and there is a pending ticket, i am sure if he noticed something wrong, he will let me know.

Originally Posted by Tigga View Post
I doubt many others make as many table alterations as his, simply because they're not necessary for that modification or because the author may not realize that altering a vB table would be better than trying to keep up with separate tables. I fully agree that it's best to avoid altering vB tables when you can, but it's often not the best practice if you want an add-on to run smoothly and without taking up any extra server resources. I'd much rather have it shut down my forum for 10 minutes during the install than to have it running extra queries during every page load after that. A 6 hour install time is obviously different, but apparently you're the only one that's experiencing times that are anywhere near that extreme, so I'd say it sounds more like DB has things balanced correctly and it's your server configuration that is suspect.
I always have my forum turned off when installing any plugin.
  #50  
Old 22 May 2014, 18:06
final kaoss final kaoss is offline
 
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Send him over here and get him posting... it's probably about time he voiced in his opinion on the matter.
  #51  
Old 22 May 2014, 18:09
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katie hunter katie hunter is offline
 
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Originally Posted by final kaoss View Post
Send him over here and get him posting... it's probably about time he voiced in his opinion on the matter.
No way, VB community isn't like Webhostingtalk. Argue, argue and fights is what i usually see on VB when it comes to proving a point and it never stops.

If you'd like to discuss about servers, the right location is here http://www.webhostingtalk.com
  #52  
Old 22 May 2014, 18:17
Necrovaris Necrovaris is offline
 
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Originally Posted by katie hunter View Post
No way, VB community isn't like Webhostingtalk. Argue, argue and fights is what i usually see on VB when it comes to proving a point and it never stops.

If you'd like to discuss about servers, the right location is here http://www.webhostingtalk.com
All the relevant information to the discussion has already been posted here, why duplicate it elsewhere.

The discussion afterall is about vBulletin addon installs.

Lets see what your guy has to say.

By the way, I see you skipped over my point of offering you the opportunity to test this on a properly configured server, using your own data as the test medium, any reason for that?
  #53  
Old 22 May 2014, 18:50
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Zachery Zachery is offline
 
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Originally Posted by katie hunter View Post
No way, VB community isn't like Webhostingtalk. Argue, argue and fights is what i usually see on VB when it comes to proving a point and it never stops.

If you'd like to discuss about servers, the right location is here http://www.webhostingtalk.com
I'd be more than willing to test on your database as well for this specific case. If you'd prefer me, over another random person.

We're not arguing, or fighting. We're showing you cold hard evidence that these addons, applied to our systems, are not taking anywhere near as long, with significantly less optimal database hardware, and environments.
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  #54  
Old 22 May 2014, 18:58
DragonByte Tech's Avatar
DragonByte Tech DragonByte Tech is offline
 
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Originally Posted by katie hunter View Post
Who said excuses.
You did. Up until this post, you were constantly making excuses as to why all the hard evidence against your claims were false.

Originally Posted by katie hunter View Post
I know what i encountered.
Nobody disputes the fact that you encountered what you encountered. Everybody disputes the fact that you believe that your results are the fault of our modifications, as opposed to your server configuration.

Originally Posted by katie hunter View Post
You want to tell me that only your plugins are causing issues on my forum when install or uninstall and all the other plugins by other members doesn't have the same affect ?
I want to tell you that you need to stop having blind faith in one person when you are faced with overwhelming evidence that irrefutably proves that there is something wrong with your server configuration.

If you were to install another product by another coder that also alters the user or post table, you would face the exact same issues. You have not installed any such modifications, and you seem to believe that this still means your sample is evidence that our products are somehow magically causing your server to behave oddly.

Originally Posted by katie hunter View Post
My server admin has access to this topic and there is a pending ticket, i am sure if he noticed something wrong, he will let me know.
I certainly hope so, because if he claims that there is nothing wrong, then he does not know his job.


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  #55  
Old 22 May 2014, 19:55
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cellarius cellarius is offline
 
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Originally Posted by katie hunter View Post
No way, VB community isn't like Webhostingtalk. Argue, argue and fights is what i usually see on VB when it comes to proving a point and it never stops.
Yes, threads you post in seem to have that tendency.

Anyway, I have followed this thread with a large bin of popcorn.
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  #56  
Old 23 May 2014, 01:05
OldSchoolDSL OldSchoolDSL is offline
 
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Originally Posted by katie hunter View Post

http://youtu.be/r0yXqU-w9U0
  #57  
Old 23 May 2014, 12:44
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Paul M Paul M is offline
 
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Originally Posted by katie hunter View Post
No way, VB community isn't like Webhostingtalk. Argue, argue and fights is what i usually see on VB when it comes to proving a point and it never stops.[/url]
Probably because you keep trying to argue a point when you are wrong.
Everyone has told you that your server is the issue, several have even proved it for you.

We still await your apology ....
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  #58  
Old 23 May 2014, 13:06
final kaoss final kaoss is offline
 
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Anyways, I'll be watching vbseo since I have a license to see what happens. Them earning back my trust probably isn't very likely though.

Here's something to help lighten up the arguing going on here with Katie however.


Last edited by final kaoss; 23 May 2014 at 13:50.
  #59  
Old 23 May 2014, 16:58
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katie hunter katie hunter is offline
 
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You guys haven't proven anything, stop dreaming about it. Especially Paul.

This is all "he say, she say" type of conversation. And of course this won't stop, the back and forth and everyone trying to prove something :0) lets go back to the main topic, Vbseo! If i ever use any of Fillip's plugin, it would be on a new project/site but not with a popular community.

I am also not a fan of plugins which alter vb tables heavily but that is just me, especially when upgrading VB to a new version, you wouldn't want to mess with how the original tables should be, it saves future problems.
  #60  
Old 23 May 2014, 17:39
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Zachery Zachery is offline
 
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Wait, you mean we run the same code you do, and it executes in a fraction of the time its taking you, that isn't proof?


There are no issues adding new tables, or new columns into tables, if you take the time to prefix your work. Otherwise any addon ever could run into the same problem.
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